For you Linux users... what's your pick - screen or tmux, and why?

Thanks.



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Re: Screen or tmux?
By: Gamgee to All on Thu Apr 29 2021 07:52 pm

For you Linux users... what's your pick - screen or tmux, and why?

Thanks.

I got started with screen, but nowadays I use tmux more often. The main reason is that it is in OpenBSD's base install, so I just got used to it. It is also licensed under a BSD-like license, if you care about such things. In addition, its keyboard commands are a bit easier for my fingers.

In the end of the day it is just another Vim vs Emacs war.


--
gopher://gopher.richardfalken.com/1/richardfalken

---
■ Synchronet ■ Palantir BBS * palantirbbs.ddns.net * Pensacola, FL

Hi Gamgee,

For you Linux users... what's your pick - screen or tmux, and why?

I'm using screen, just because that's the command I learned first and it works just fine for the purposes I need it, which are mostly "keep a session open even if I get disconnected from my SSH session" and "use a single SSH session but run multiple shell commands in parallel".
And I got used to the basic Ctrl-A key commands :)

Regards,
Anna

---
￭ Synchronet ￭ Imzadi Box -*- box.imzadi.de

I use tmux... I has a status bar that's useful to check the session id
and it's easier.


On 29/04/2021 21:52, Gamgee wrote:

For you Linux users... what's your pick - screen or tmux, and why?

Thanks.

... All hope abandon, ye who enter messages here.
--- MultiMail/Linux v0.52
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---
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Arelor wrote to Gamgee <=-

For you Linux users... what's your pick - screen or tmux, and why?

I got started with screen, but nowadays I use tmux more often.
The main reason is that it is in OpenBSD's base install, so I
just got used to it. It is also licensed under a BSD-like
license, if you care about such things. In addition, its keyboard
commands are a bit easier for my fingers.

Okay. The commands are all customizable if desired... I've always used
screen too, but have been playing with tmux some lately. It does have
some VERY nice features, and is very configurable. I especially like
being able to have more than one "window" available (proper term might
be "session", I'm not sure). Also splitting it into multi panes is very
cool. I will probably eventually switch over to using it exclusively.

In the end of the day it is just another Vim vs Emacs war.

Hehe, I suppose that is probably true. Nano for the win. ;-)



... Alimony: Bounty on the Mutiny
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acn wrote to Gamgee <=-

For you Linux users... what's your pick - screen or tmux, and why?

I'm using screen, just because that's the command I learned first
and it works just fine for the purposes I need it, which are
mostly "keep a session open even if I get disconnected from my
SSH session" and "use a single SSH session but run multiple shell
commands in parallel".

Yeah, same here. Take a look at tmux if you get bored, it has some
pretty cool features that go a little beyond screen. I still mostly use screen too, but will likely move to tmux eventually.

And I got used to the basic Ctrl-A key commands :)

Yep. Tmux uses Ctrl-B as it's prefix by default, which is extremely
awkward, but thankfully it's easily configured to Ctrl-A. ;-)



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Abaffa wrote to Gamgee <=-

I use tmux... I has a status bar that's useful to check the
session id and it's easier.

Yep, I like that too. Thanks for the reply.



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Re: Re: Screen or tmux?
By: Gamgee to acn on Fri Apr 30 2021 07:46 am

Yep. Tmux uses Ctrl-B as it's prefix by default, which is extremely awkward, but thankfully it's easily configured to Ctrl-A. ;-)

Yeah, Ctrl-B doesn't work for me (being a vi/vim user) - so it's the first thing I change when using tmux (which admittedly, isn't all that often).
--
digital man

Rush quote #61:
He's a rebel and a runner, he's a signal turning green .. New World Man
Norco, CA WX: 90.9°F, 17.0% humidity, 8 mph E wind, 0.00 inches rain/24hrs

Re: Re: Screen or tmux?
By: Gamgee to Arelor on Fri Apr 30 2021 07:43 am

Okay. The commands are all customizable if desired... I've always used screen too, but have been playing with tmux some lately. It does have some VERY nice features, and is very configurable. I especially like being able to have more than one "window" available (proper term might
be "session", I'm not sure). Also splitting it into multi panes is very cool. I will probably eventually switch over to using it exclusively.

I'm with you on this.

I've been using screen for a loooong time, but discovered tmuxinator for the MAC, with some themes, which provides a nice sexy screen.

So I'm in the process of switching over to tmux and having to learn the tmux way of things - all because of a sexy screen!

I'm probably using 2% of it right now, and its on my list to understand it more, but thats enough for me to be dangerous now.

...δεσ∩

... Money can't buy friends but you can get a better class of enemy.

---
■ Synchronet ■ Alterant | an SBBS in Docker on Pi!

Gamgee wrote:

For you Linux users... what's your pick - screen or tmux, and why?

I use screen because I'm used to it. Does everything I need.

---
■ Synchronet ■ End Of The Line BBS - endofthelinebbs.com

Digital Man wrote to Gamgee <=-

Yep. Tmux uses Ctrl-B as it's prefix by default, which is extremely awkward, but thankfully it's easily configured to Ctrl-A. ;-)

Yeah, Ctrl-B doesn't work for me (being a vi/vim user) - so it's
the first thing I change when using tmux (which admittedly, isn't
all that often).

Hard to believe that *anyone* would actually prefer Ctrl-B... :-)

You probably already know this, but you can "permanently" define your
desired prefix key in a config file (Linux "dotfile") called .tmux.conf

My very simple config looks like this:

# remap prefix from 'C-b' to 'C-a'
unbind C-b
set-option -g prefix C-a
bind-key C-a send-prefix

# split panes using | and -
bind | split-window -h
bind - split-window -v
unbind '"'
unbind %

# switch panes using Alt-arrow without prefix
bind -n M-Left select-pane -L
bind -n M-Right select-pane -R
bind -n M-Up select-pane -U
bind -n M-Down select-pane -D


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deon wrote to Gamgee <=-

Okay. The commands are all customizable if desired... I've always used screen too, but have been playing with tmux some lately. It does have some VERY nice features, and is very configurable. I especially like being able to have more than one "window" available (proper term might
be "session", I'm not sure). Also splitting it into multi panes is very cool. I will probably eventually switch over to using it exclusively.

I'm with you on this.

I've been using screen for a loooong time, but discovered
tmuxinator for the MAC, with some themes, which provides a nice
sexy screen.

So I'm in the process of switching over to tmux and having to
learn the tmux way of things - all because of a sexy screen!

Cosmetic appeal is very important to most people. I don't use a Mac,
but I bet it looks good!

I'm probably using 2% of it right now, and its on my list to
understand it more, but thats enough for me to be dangerous now.

I'm in the same place. I really like it and am going to get better at
using it, at least the basics. The multi-pane stuff (split windows) is especially attractive to me.


... How do they get Teflon to stick to the pans?
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Nelgin wrote to Gamgee <=-

For you Linux users... what's your pick - screen or tmux, and why?

I use screen because I'm used to it. Does everything I need.

Yeah, I've always looked at it that way too. The thing is, once you see
some of the features that can be used, you start to wonder "How did I
ever get by without this?" :-)

The split-window options are excellent. CLI multitasking. Hahaha


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I'm using screen, just because that's the command I learned first and it works just fine for the purposes I need it, which are mostly "keep a session open even if I get disconnected from my SSH session" and "use a single SSH session but run multiple shell commands in parallel".
And I got used to the basic Ctrl-A key commands :)

I'm jumping in here, and apologies for such. :P

I do not use screen/tmux... I've used it a time or two that I needed to do something special with irssi (put handles on the left side of screen..) but I don't understand/know what its uses ARE.

I think I can... SSH into my BBS box and say, run the server.. and if I close the SSH window it'll keep the server open on the BBS Box side?

Would you mind explaining a quick overview of what screen is? And used for? Possibly how it help sysOps running a BBS on another system on their network.

Also, pls know that I'm 'man screen'ing right now... :P



|07p|15AULIE|1142|07o
|08.........

On 01 May 2021, paulie420 said the following...

I do not use screen/tmux... I've used it a time or two that I needed to
do something special with irssi (put handles on the left side of
screen..) but I don't understand/know what its uses ARE.

traditionally when a process's controlling terminal closes, the programs running in it close. so yeah, like if your ssh session were to disconnect because the power went out, what you were currently doing would abruptly end. this could be particularly annoying if you were doing something like compiling firefox ;) (from remote i guess so the server still had power lol)

so now screen/tmux take the role of controlling terminal and have special handling for that event.

this probably mattered more when these machines were actually multiuser (as in actual people) and resources were scarce. there are a few public *nix machines out there that do still limit users to one process running while they're not logged in (or one + tmux).

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A47 2021/04/20 (Windows/32)
* Origin: cold fusion - cfbbs.net - grand rapids, mi

Re: Re: Screen or tmux?
By: Digital Man to Gamgee on Fri Apr 30 2021 04:57 pm

Yeah, Ctrl-B doesn't work for me (being a vi/vim user) - so it's the first thing I change when using tmux (which admittedly, isn't
all that often).

What does Ctrl-B do in vi?

(Learning something new about vi every day, and I've only been using it since forever..)

...δεσ∩

... True love is when you spend £50 for an operation on a £5 dog.

---
■ Synchronet ■ Alterant | an SBBS in Docker on Pi!

Re: Re: Screen or tmux?
By: paulie420 to acn on Sat May 01 2021 10:31 am

Hey Paulie,

I do not use screen/tmux... I've used it a time or two that I needed to do something special with irssi (put handles on the left side
of screen..) but I don't understand/know what its uses ARE.

The main reason I started using it is for disconnected sessions.

I can jump into a box, do some work, disconnect, comeback later, re-connect and see what happened.

In the old modem dialup internet days (or iffy internet connections), this was a saviour.

These days, I work at my desk on an iMac, or sit in front of the TV with a MacBook - and I can "switch" to either and continue where I left off.

The other benefit, especially when developing, one window "pane" is the tail of a debug log file, while another is an interface into the DB and the 3rd where I'm watching incoming HTTP requests. I can zoom into any pane to see more content, or have all 3 on the screen at once while I'm trying to figure out why an API call is failing.



...δεσ∩

... Chuck Norris counted to infinity - twice.

---
■ Synchronet ■ Alterant | an SBBS in Docker on Pi!

Re: Re: Screen or tmux?
By: deon to Digital Man on Sun May 02 2021 09:48 am

Re: Re: Screen or tmux?
By: Digital Man to Gamgee on Fri Apr 30 2021 04:57 pm

Yeah, Ctrl-B doesn't work for me (being a vi/vim user) - so it's the first thing I change when using tmux (which admittedly, isn't
all that often).

What does Ctrl-B do in vi?

Scrolls backward (Ctrl-F for forward).

(Learning something new about vi every day, and I've only been using it since forever..)

Oh, I know there's plenty about vi/vim I still don't know.

One thing my fingers learned long ago though: Ctrl-[ (to exit edit mode) is quicker than reaching for the ESC key.
--
digital man

Rush quote #23:
Plus ca change, plus c'est la meme chose
Norco, CA WX: 70.5°F, 57.0% humidity, 10 mph NE wind, 0.00 inches rain/24hrs

traditionally when a process's controlling terminal closes, the programs running in it close. so yeah, like if your ssh session were to disconnect because the power went out, what you were currently doing would abruptly end. this could be particularly annoying if you were doing something
like compiling firefox ;) (from remote i guess so the server still had power lol)

Understood - and is there a way to get back to that process again, from either the host OS or a new remote ssh (or whatever)? And... if thats the ENTIRE thing, as stated, I can man it... just chit chatting. :P



|07p|15AULIE|1142|07o
|08.........

The main reason I started using it is for disconnected sessions.

I can jump into a box, do some work, disconnect, comeback later, re-connect and see what happened.

Awesome. I just asked another posted this question - and thanks.. so it seems like I *need* to brush up on and learn to use screen. As you stated, it sounds like a saviour - and I've USED it before when... told to; but I didn't grasp it.

I will after today, however. :P Thanks all.
Thanks Deon.



|07p|15AULIE|1142|07o
|08.........

paulie420 wrote to acn <=-

I'm using screen, just because that's the command I learned first and it works just fine for the purposes I need it, which are mostly "keep a session open even if I get disconnected from my SSH session" and "use a single SSH session but run multiple shell commands in parallel".
And I got used to the basic Ctrl-A key commands :)

I'm jumping in here, and apologies for such. :P

Jumping in is allowed, and encouraged!

I do not use screen/tmux... I've used it a time or two that I
needed to do something special with irssi (put handles on the
left side of screen..) but I don't understand/know what its uses
ARE.

I think I can... SSH into my BBS box and say, run the server..
and if I close the SSH window it'll keep the server open on the
BBS Box side?

Yes.

Would you mind explaining a quick overview of what screen is? And
used for? Possibly how it help sysOps running a BBS on another
system on their network.

It's a terminal multiplexer. It allows you to connect into a remote
system, open a screen session (terminal), and run something in that
terminal. You can then "detach" from that screen session, close your
SSH connection, and go on with whatever else you might be doing. Later,
you can SSH back to that machine, and "reconnect" to that open terminal
which is still running whatever you started in it.

Here's an example of one way that I use it. I have an Raspberry Pi
running 24x7, which does various things for me (it does not run my BBS though). I SSH to it from my laptop (either from within the LAN, or
remotely from another state if I'm traveling). I have opened a screen
session on it, and started the 'irssi' IRC client in that terminal.
This connects and idles in the Synchronet IRC channel. I then can
detach from that session (with Ctrl-A, D), and close my SSH connection.
A few hours, or a few days later, I can SSH back to the RPi, restore my
screen session (with "screen -r"), and BAM! my irssi client is there
where I can scroll back and see what's been talked about while I was
gone. Maybe I add some comments, whatever. Then I detach and close
again, and the irssi client continues running while I'm gone. This
allows me to maintain a "presence" in that channel even if I'm not
actively watching it for a while, and I can catch up when it's
convenient for me. You can open as many screen sessions on a remote
host as you'd like, all doing something different, and all will keep on working after you detach. Pretty cool stuff.

Also, pls know that I'm 'man screen'ing right now... :P

Good call!



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Re: Re: Screen or tmux?
By: Digital Man to deon on Sat May 01 2021 05:47 pm

What does Ctrl-B do in vi?

Scrolls backward (Ctrl-F for forward).

Ahh, ofcourse - I have used it sometimes but not that often.

One thing my fingers learned long ago though: Ctrl-[ (to exit edit mode) is quicker than reaching for the ESC key.

So I dont use either of those - I'm a :wq! or :q! exit guy !

...δεσ∩

... I used to be an agnostic, but now I'm not so sure.

---
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Re: Re: Screen or tmux?
By: deon to Digital Man on Sun May 02 2021 13:08:42

One thing my fingers learned long ago though: Ctrl-[ (to exit edit
mode) is quicker than reaching for the ESC key.

So I dont use either of those - I'm a :wq! or :q! exit guy !

You still have to "ESC" before you can :x if you're in edit/insert mode. That's what the ctrl-[ is helpful for.. Interesingly enough, my ESC key is broken, so other than using an on-screen keyboard, I've had to figure this out lately... ;-)

BoonDock

* El Gato de Fuego * The Fire Cat * Pedasi, Panama

... The cause of problems are solutions!

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Re: Re: Screen or tmux?
By: BoonDock to deon on Sun May 02 2021 12:30 am

Howdy,

You still have to "ESC" before you can :x if you're in edit/insert mode. That's what the ctrl-[ is helpful for.. Interesingly enough,
my ESC key is broken, so other than using an on-screen keyboard, I've had to figure this out lately... ;-)

So you do. Its muscle memory for me and I do it without thinking about it.

...δεσ∩

... Diplomacy: The patriotic art of lying for one's country.

---
■ Synchronet ■ Alterant | an SBBS in Docker on Pi!

Re: Screen or tmux?
By: Gamgee to All on Thu Apr 29 2021 19:52:00

ohmyzsh + ohmytmux + powerline10k + spacevim. Configurable, customizable, can bind all the keys to do the things I want it to do. You can also recover your windows and setup post reboot with tmux-resurrect or tmux-continuum.

For you Linux users... what's your pick - screen or tmux, and why?

Thanks.

... All hope abandon, ye who enter messages here.

---
■ Synchronet ■ Baffa BBS... from old times...

I do not use screen/tmux... I've used it a time or two that I needed to
do something special with irssi (put handles on the left side of
screen..) but I don't understand/know what its uses ARE.

My two use cases are Weechat and Minecraft Server seems to want to run
in foreground, it does make it easy to connect back to MC server and issue commands. Apart from that I do prefer to run things as background processes.

RenMas

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Jimmy Mac wrote to Gamgee <=-

Re: Screen or tmux?
By: Gamgee to All on Thu Apr 29 2021 19:52:00

ohmyzsh + ohmytmux + powerline10k + spacevim. Configurable,
customizable, can bind all the keys to do the things I want it to
do. You can also recover your windows and setup post reboot with tmux-resurrect or tmux-continuum.

Interesting..... thanks.



... If it weren't for Edison we'd be using computers by candlelight
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Jimmy Mac wrote to Gamgee <=-

@MSGID: <608E25EC.21.dove-unix@baffa.zapto.org>
@REPLY: <608B54B9.392.dove-unix@palantirbbs.ddns.net>
Re: Screen or tmux?
By: Gamgee to All on Thu
Apr 29 2021 19:52:00

ohmyzsh + ohmytmux + powerline10k + spacevim. Configurable,
customizable, can bind all the keys to do the things I want it to do.
You can also recover your windows and setup post reboot with tmux-resurrect or tmux-continuum.

For you Linux users... what's your pick - screen or tmux, and why?

Thanks.

Screen, but only really because that is what I learned and know, and because it has zmodem support, which is kind of cool, not because I think it is better.

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It's a terminal multiplexer. It allows you to connect into a remote system, open a screen session (terminal), and run something in that terminal. You can then "detach" from that screen session, close your
SSH connection, and go on with whatever else you might be doing. Later, you can SSH back to that machine, and "reconnect" to that open terminal which is still running whatever you started in it.

Awesome; what I've learned so far is that I'm missing out by not using one or the other. I know screen a little, so I guess I'll start there.. stupid, too - its exactly what I've needed on many occasions. Derp.

Here's an example of one way that I use it. I have an Raspberry Pi running 24x7, which does various things for me (it does not run my BBS though). I SSH to it from my laptop (either from within the LAN, or remotely from another state if I'm traveling). I have opened a screen session on it, and started the 'irssi' IRC client in that terminal.
This connects and idles in the Synchronet IRC channel. I then can
detach from that session (with Ctrl-A, D), and close my SSH connection. A few hours, or a few days later, I can SSH back to the RPi, restore my screen session (with "screen -r"), and BAM! my irssi client is there where I can scroll back and see what's been talked about while I was gone. Maybe I add some comments, whatever. Then I detach and close again, and the irssi client continues running while I'm gone. This allows me to maintain a "presence" in that channel even if I'm not actively watching it for a while, and I can catch up when it's
convenient for me. You can open as many screen sessions on a remote
host as you'd like, all doing something different, and all will keep on working after you detach. Pretty cool stuff.

Yep... awesome. :P I'll be doing the same exact thing shortly. Like I can have one Raspberry Pi that allows me access to my local network and screen around from there. Again, I'll brush up myself but... seems like I can have a few things 'screened' and ... I'm sure theres a way to get a list of whats open on what screens... :P

I should have investigated this long ago - as I've used it with irssi, too, to put the handle lists on the right hand side of the screen - but I didn't realize that it does much more for the type of computery stuff I do all the time. :P

(I'll admit that I've used VNC to do much the same... with a lot more resources that screen would take. Ugh.)



|07p|15AULIE|1142|07o
|08.........

Re: Re: Screen or tmux?
By: deon to Digital Man on Sun May 02 2021 01:08 pm

One thing my fingers learned long ago though: Ctrl-[ (to exit edit mode) is quicker than reaching for the ESC key.

So I dont use either of those - I'm a :wq! or :q! exit guy !

How do you exit edit mode?
--
digital man

This Is Spinal Tap quote #46:
"Not an Exit" - we don't want an exit. Well that's true.
Norco, CA WX: 63.9°F, 66.0% humidity, 6 mph ENE wind, 0.00 inches rain/24hrs

Nelgin wrote to Gamgee <=-

I use screen because I'm used to it. Does everything I need.

I have a love / hate relationship with screen. Even on the best of
days, screen breaks emulation when I go between traditional Linux-based
systems and AIX. AIX uses vt220/vt320 throughout SMIT (smitty). I've
got to the point where I don't use SMIT because the emulation keeps
getting trashed and have to remember command-line syntaxes that go
upwards of 100 characters. :|


Brian Klauss <-> Dream Master
Caught in a Dream | caughtinadream.com a Synchronet BBS

... Gone crazy, be back later, please leave message.
--- MultiMail/Mac v0.52
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Gamgee wrote to All <=-

For you Linux users... what's your pick - screen or tmux, and why?

Tmux - it just makes more sense to me. I'm a little late to the game,
playing more with screen multiplexers now. Where I used to open a couple of Putty sessions, I can now do everything with one session and Tmux.


... Look at the order in which you do things
--- MultiMail/DOS v0.52
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Arelor wrote to Gamgee <=-

In the end of the day it is just another Vim vs Emacs war.

Makes me want to dig up my old geek code block and update it to add a screen multiplexer listing.



... Look at the order in which you do things
--- MultiMail/DOS v0.52
■ Synchronet ■ realitycheckBBS -- http://realitycheckBBS.org

Re: Re: Screen or tmux?
By: Dream Master to Nelgin on Mon May 03 2021 08:13 am

I use picocom. It's got enough command line switches to
warrant a shell script to launch it.

Will convert line endings on the fly; supports ascii-xfr.

I use it to talk to microcontrollers via USART or USB
(CDC/ACM stuff).

I have no idea if it'll telnet or ssh.

Sometimes I'll try tinyfugue by .. I don't remember .. at
some point I'm pretty sure I need to be listening for telnet
inbound connections to use tinyfugue effectively (because it
was designed to talk to telnet destinations such as LambdaMOO).

So I probably /world localhost or similar to telnet to the
(Linux) locahost. When I get a shell prompt (split screen,
like IRSSI for example) I can then ssh out to a BBS on the
Internet.

SCREEN is great if you have a shell account on someone else's
machine, because of the detach/attach feature; it lets you
stay logged into a BBS that doesn't time out your session,
even when your modem has dropped carrier (including shutting
down a DSL modem for any reason you may want to do so).

---
■ Synchronet ■ My Brand-New BBS

poindexter FORTRAN wrote to Gamgee <=-

For you Linux users... what's your pick - screen or tmux, and why?

Tmux - it just makes more sense to me. I'm a little late to the
game, playing more with screen multiplexers now. Where I used to
open a couple of Putty sessions, I can now do everything with one
session and Tmux.

Well, to be fair, it sounds like you could also do that with one session
and screen.

The question is why would one choose one or the other (tmux or screen)?



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Gamgee wrote to poindexter FORTRAN <=-

The question is why would one choose one or the other (tmux or screen)?

<flips coin>

I'm on tilde.club and someone on there wrote a nice HOWTO on using tmux.
Once I started googling tmux, my google news feed was *filled* with helpful web sites outlining how to use it.




... Change ambiguities to specifics
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poindexter FORTRAN wrote to Gamgee <=-

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Gamgee wrote to poindexter FORTRAN <=-

The question is why would one choose one or the other (tmux or screen)?

<flips coin>

I'm on tilde.club and someone on there wrote a nice HOWTO on using
tmux. Once I started googling tmux, my google news feed was *filled*
with helpful web sites outlining how to use it.

It tmux had zmodem support, I would switch, but it doesn't. I am actually using tmux now to try it out. I actually find it useful for a quick file transfer, its a little more convienient than using SSH or netcat.

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Re: Re: Screen or tmux?
By: Boraxman to poindexter FORTRAN on Thu May 06 2021 08:04 am

poindexter FORTRAN wrote to Gamgee <=-

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Gamgee wrote to poindexter FORTRAN <=-

The question is why would one choose one or the other (tmux or screen)?

<flips coin>

I'm on tilde.club and someone on there wrote a nice HOWTO on using tmux. Once I started googling tmux, my google news feed was *filled* with helpful web sites outlining how to use it.

It tmux had zmodem support, I would switch, but it doesn't. I am actually using tm
now to try it out. I actually find it useful for a quick file transfer, its a litt
more convienient than using SSH or netcat.

... MultiMail, the new multi-platform, multi-format offline reader!

I used c-kermit under tmux for a while in order to handle XYZModem stuff for a while.
It works ok. Still it looks like the process is a bit more streamlined under screen,
or that is the memory I have from when I looked into the documentation.

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Re: Re: Screen or tmux?
By: poindexter FORTRAN to Gamgee on Fri Apr 30 2021 06:59 am

Gamgee wrote to All <=-

For you Linux users... what's your pick - screen or tmux, and why?

Tmux - it just makes more sense to me. I'm a little late to the game, playing more with screen multiplexers now. Where I used to open a couple of Putty sessions, I can now do everything with one session and Tmux.

Honestly I think you're in a good position. I use screen because I've been around for a while and screen was the first really decent terminal
multiplexer. The codebase for GNU Screen is pretty gnarly and there's not a
lot of substantial development on it to speak of. tmux has a cleaner (and smaller/simpler) codebase and attracts more development.

I tried tmux once and it was fine. I spent all my time configuration it to
work like screen and thought "well, this is pointless, I'll just use screen".
I think if I were coming into it new and didn't have any habits and muscle-memory built up, I would start with tmux, though.

I'll use screen until I need something screen can't do, and then I'll switch
to tmux, I think.




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Ksource wrote to poindexter FORTRAN <=-

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Re: Re: Screen or tmux?
By: poindexter FORTRAN to Gamgee
on Fri Apr 30 2021 06:59 am

Gamgee wrote to All <=-

For you Linux users... what's your pick - screen or tmux, and why?

Tmux - it just makes more sense to me. I'm a little late to the game, playing more with screen multiplexers now. Where I used to open a couple of Putty sessions, I can now do everything with one session and Tmux.

Honestly I think you're in a good position. I use screen because I've
been around for a while and screen was the first really decent terminal multiplexer. The codebase for GNU Screen is pretty gnarly and there's
not a lot of substantial development on it to speak of. tmux has a
cleaner (and smaller/simpler) codebase and attracts more development.

I tried tmux once and it was fine. I spent all my time configuration it
to work like screen and thought "well, this is pointless, I'll just use screen". I think if I were coming into it new and didn't have any
habits and muscle-memory built up, I would start with tmux, though.

I'll use screen until I need something screen can't do, and then I'll switch to tmux, I think.

I've started trying Tmux in place of Screen, and I like it, but for the most part, screen has all the functionality I need anyway, and the zmodem support that screen has is actually more useful than you think.

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part, screen has all the functionality I need anyway, and the zmodem suppo that screen has is actually more useful than you think.

Funny - I've used `screen` for years and never come across zmodem support. I use that feature of SecureCRT a lot, to drop files onto my terminal session
and upload. I'm guessing this is what screen does as well?! I'll have to
check it out.

~pv

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PhazeVektor wrote to Boraxman <=-

@MSGID: <60A53838.11131.dove-lnx@vert.synchro.net>

part, screen has all the functionality I need anyway, and the zmodem suppo that screen has is actually more useful than you think.

Funny - I've used `screen` for years and never come across zmodem
support. I use that feature of SecureCRT a lot, to drop files onto my terminal session and upload. I'm guessing this is what screen does as well?! I'll have to check it out.

Sort of. With screen, you set the zmodem setting to "catch", and when you run "sz" or "rz" on the remote machine, screen will pick it up, and prompt you to run "rz" or "sz" on the local machine. Annoyingly, when you send on the local machine, you have to type the path (so it means you have to remember the full filename, there is no selector). But it works. Sometimes you need to add the '-e' option to escape control sequences.

SCP is better, but when you are already logged on, then it saves you opening up another terminal.

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On 2021-04-30, Gamgee <gamgee@PALANT> wrote:

For you Linux users... what's your pick - screen or tmux, and why?

Thanks.

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Tmux user here, because of OpenBSD base and well, I set
a clonic OpenBSD base under Void Linux, with very close
config and constraints. As a plug, I have framebuffer
support for SDL(2), mplayer, mpv, fbi, fbpdf2 and fbdjvu.
For comic books, I use fbi+a script to uncompress the files,
and for IM, bitlbee+kirc work well, among links,s-nail and
getmail.
I've been weeks without X, and I won't miss it. Groff+Mom
typesets math perfectly, gnuplot is dumb easy and sc-im
and catdoc and/or antiword will do the same on docx/rtf/
xls files.
Current games require 16GB of RAM, a 20x more powerful GPU
and a 10x better CPU, so that's a no-no for me.
Slashem, interactive fiction and mednafen could keep me busy
for years.

anthk wrote to Gamgee <=-

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@REPLY: <608B54B9.392.dove-unix@palantirbbs.ddns.net>
On 2021-04-30, Gamgee <gamgee@PALANT> wrote:

For you Linux users... what's your pick - screen or tmux, and why?

Thanks.

... All hope abandon, ye who enter messages here.
--- MultiMail/Linux v0.52

Tmux user here, because of OpenBSD base and well, I set
a clonic OpenBSD base under Void Linux, with very close
config and constraints. As a plug, I have framebuffer
support for SDL(2), mplayer, mpv, fbi, fbpdf2 and fbdjvu.
For comic books, I use fbi+a script to uncompress the files,
and for IM, bitlbee+kirc work well, among links,s-nail and
getmail.
I've been weeks without X, and I won't miss it. Groff+Mom
typesets math perfectly, gnuplot is dumb easy and sc-im
and catdoc and/or antiword will do the same on docx/rtf/
xls files.
Current games require 16GB of RAM, a 20x more powerful GPU
and a 10x better CPU, so that's a no-no for me.
Slashem, interactive fiction and mednafen could keep me busy
for years.

---

Using tmux at the moment, but I'm pretty ambivalent about whether I use screen or tmux. I'm using tmux because the keybindings on how to split a screen are fresh in my head, I don't remember them for screen. I have a menu set to SSH into particular servers, and those shortcuts set up a terminal with screen. Screen has ZMODEM support which I do use.

However I've found that systemd now terminates all your processes when you log out, including detached screen and tmux sessions!

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Re: Re: Screen or tmux?
By: Boraxman to anthk on Thu Sep 23 2021 05:47 pm

screen are fresh in my head, I don't remember them for screen. I have a menu set to SSH into particular servers, and those shortcuts set up a terminal with screen. Screen has ZMODEM support which I do use.

how do you even use zmodem with screen?
do you just run it on auto in the screen session?
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MRO wrote to Boraxman <=-

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Re: Re: Screen or tmux?
By: Boraxman to anthk on Thu Sep 23 2021 05:47 pm

screen are fresh in my head, I don't remember them for screen. I have a menu set to SSH into particular servers, and those shortcuts set up a terminal with screen. Screen has ZMODEM support which I do use.

You enable zmodem with the "zmodem catch" config option. This will detect and zmodem escape sequences. When it detects one, screen will then prompt you to run the corresponding sz/rz command at your end.

So how it works is this. You start screen, then ssh/telnet to the remote server. On the remote server you initiate either rz or sz depending on whether you want to send or receive, and screen will then bring up a prompt with sz or rz, allowing you to run then on the local end. When you accept that command, the transfer proceeds.

Its convienient when you ssh to a remote server, and just want to send an adhoc file back or forth.

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Re: Re: Screen or tmux?
By: Boraxman to MRO on Fri Sep 24 2021 03:31 pm

whether you want to send or receive, and screen will then bring up a prompt with sz or rz, allowing you to run then on the local end. When you accept that command, the transfer proceeds.

Its convienient when you ssh to a remote server, and just want to send an adhoc file back or forth.

oh, i made a script that i use with winscp.com for sending files to my server. ---
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MRO wrote to Boraxman <=-

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Re: Re: Screen or tmux?
By: Boraxman to MRO on Fri Sep 24 2021 03:31 pm

whether you want to send or receive, and screen will then bring up a prompt with sz or rz, allowing you to run then on the local end. When you accept that command, the transfer proceeds.

Its convienient when you ssh to a remote server, and just want to send an adhoc file back or forth.

oh, i made a script that i use with winscp.com for sending files to my server. ---

I use Linux, so SCP is an option, but it means starting another shell to run the command. Zmodem means I can do it within the shell.

For Windows users, you can use LePutty, which is Putty with zmodem support. Wouldn't have thought it would still be useful, but it is.


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Boraxman wrote to MRO <=-

whether you want to send or receive, and screen will then bring up a prompt with sz or rz, allowing you to run then on the local end. When you accept that command, the transfer proceeds.

Its convienient when you ssh to a remote server, and just want to send an adhoc file back or forth.

oh, i made a script that i use with winscp.com for sending files to my server.

I use Linux, so SCP is an option, but it means starting another
shell to run the command. Zmodem means I can do it within the
shell.

Did not know about this ability within screen. Very cool. Just tried
it and it works perfectly.

Thanks for bringing this up.



... So easy, a child could do it. Child sold separately.
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Re: Re: Screen or tmux?
By: Gamgee to Boraxman on Sat Sep 25 2021 09:55 am

whether you want to send or receive, and screen will then bring up a
prompt with sz or rz, allowing you to run then on the local end.
When you accept that command, the transfer proceeds.

Its convienient when you ssh to a remote server, and just want to
send an adhoc file back or forth.

oh, i made a script that i use with winscp.com for sending files to
my server.

I use Linux, so SCP is an option, but it means starting another
shell to run the command. Zmodem means I can do it within the
shell.

Did not know about this ability within screen. Very cool. Just tried
it and it works perfectly.

I use MobaXTerm in windows which has a small built-in scp gui where you can click/drag files to transfer them. It's not free, but it's well worth it, especially when you have to deal with and organize over a thousand different servers.

DaiTengu

... She drowned at the end of her life.

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DaiTengu wrote to Gamgee <=-

I use Linux, so SCP is an option, but it means starting another
shell to run the command. Zmodem means I can do it within the
shell.

Did not know about this ability within screen. Very cool. Just tried
it and it works perfectly.

I use MobaXTerm in windows which has a small built-in scp gui
where you can click/drag files to transfer them. It's not free,
but it's well worth it, especially when you have to deal with and
organize over a thousand different servers.

Thankfully, Windows is not something I have to deal with.



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DaiTengu wrote to Gamgee <=-

I use MobaXTerm in windows which has a small built-in scp gui where
you can click/drag files to transfer them. It's not free, but it's
well worth it, especially when you have to deal with and organize over
a thousand different servers.

I'll have to take another look at MobaXTerm. We're using a combination of Putty, WinSCP and an autologin plugin for Keepass that's nice.

Keys most places to autologin, and Keepass to automate SSH/RDP elsewhere.

I wish there was an easy way to package Putty destinations and share them,
we have 10 developers and it'd be nice to package all of the usual hosts
when I image systems for them.


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Hello poindexter;

poindexter FORTRAN wrote to DaiTengu <=-

It's not free

I've used it in the past and my copies were free. They requested you purchased it of course but it wasn't crippled.

I'll have to take another look at MobaXTerm. We're using a combination
of Putty, WinSCP and an autologin plugin for Keepass that's nice.

Of course, you can write your own shell script I'm sure. Perhaps rsync may be of assistance?


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Re: Re: Screen or tmux?
By: Gamgee to DaiTengu on Sat Sep 25 2021 08:40 pm

I use Linux, so SCP is an option, but it means starting another
shell to run the command. Zmodem means I can do it within the
shell.

Did not know about this ability within screen. Very cool. Just
tried it and it works perfectly.

I use MobaXTerm in windows which has a small built-in scp gui
where you can click/drag files to transfer them. It's not free,
but it's well worth it, especially when you have to deal with and
organize over a thousand different servers.

Thankfully, Windows is not something I have to deal with.

I use Windows on my primary computer, as I play video games, and a lot of the ham radio stuff I have also requires windows (getting any of that stuff to run reliably under WINE is a nightmare I don't want to deal with).

The other 6 computers sitting around me are all running some flavor of Linux, and one runs BSD.

DaiTengu

... A bachelor never makes the same mistake once.

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Re: Re: Screen or tmux?
By: poindexter FORTRAN to DaiTengu on Sun Sep 26 2021 10:53 am

I wish there was an easy way to package Putty destinations and share them, we have 10 developers and it'd be nice to package all of the usual hosts when I image systems for them.

It should be pretty easy to create a web page with links to all the servers people need to access. a browser can auto-launch PuTTY. They'd just need to make sure their key was loaded.

DaiTengu

... But soft, what light through yonder tagline breaks?

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DaiTengu wrote to poindexter FORTRAN <=-

It should be pretty easy to create a web page with links to all the servers people need to access. a browser can auto-launch PuTTY. They'd just need to make sure their key was loaded.

I've been playing with Dashy on my home lab; I've got a destination web page at work on our outward-facing reverse proxy that could easily be a web page inside the firewall, accessible via VPN. That might be a nice project.


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Quoting poindexter FORTRAN to DaiTengu <=-

I wish there was an easy way to package Putty destinations and share
them, we have 10 developers and it'd be nice to package all of the
usual hosts when I image systems for them.

It's been a while, but you may be able to copy the settings from a
subdirectory of %localappdata% or %programdata%, then propagate them to
the other systems in whatever your favorite method is.

Jazzy J



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... Afraid of speed? Use Windows!

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